In this concluding part, Omojuwa dissects and proffers solutions to issues around unemployment, Boko-Haram, his anger with people likening him to Reuben Abati, and which topic he won't discuss on twitter amongst others. In case you missed the first part here is the link http://larigold.blogspot.com/2012/08/exclusive-interview-i-do-not-speak.html
Lanre
Olagunju: you talked about the
involvement of young people especially via the use of social media…what other
result oriented things can young people do so as to redeem the country.
Omojuwa: first of all we
have to understand that you cannot bring about change in other people or change
anything until you bring about change in yourself. So these young people that
are saying that they want to change the system and all that what are they doing
with their own lives and what are they doing with their time? It’s not enough to be passionate about change
in Nigeria. If you are not competent you’ll get there and mess things up. Any
idiot can be passionate, a thief can be passionate. Passion is a driver that
pushes you to do that which you want to do. And if you’re not able to do it,
passion will drive you to mess it up. So it’s not all about passion. Being
passionate is good, but it’s about competence. Young people have to build
competence and ability because the time will come when they’d also be in charge
when they’d also run the country. Without competence it’s going to result in
the same tragic story. So the first thing is that they should build competence
then secondly they must align and create synergy by coming together which is
not there at the moment. These days many young people are doing the same thing
and it’s beginning to look like a competition. Young people need to come
together and think as a people and not individuals. They must also insulate
themselves from the grab-grab Nigerian mentality that says when you get there
you sort out yourself first. We need to start thinking for the whole and not
just ourselves. Then we must have the understanding of where to place money and
wealth. We must begin to understand how to think in terms of prosperity, how to
think in terms of the fact that the world has created a lot of wealthy men that
are dead and forgotten but the world hasn’t created great men that are
forgotten. So we must aspire toward greatness and not just riches in terms of
silver and gold. Greatness comes by being a change agent in the real sense of
the word. In my opinion we don’t have great Nigerians in the class of Nelson
Mandela and Barack Obama despite his failures in America and Abraham Lincoln.
We need nationalist that think for the nation and not what they can grab out of
the system. Young people should begin to think like that.
Lanre
Olagunju: if you were in the shoes of GEJ, strategically what would you have
done to phase out corruption?
Omojuwa: In terms of
corruption in Nigeria… you can’t phase out corruption anywhere in the world but
you can fight it to the barest minimum and when it comes to fighting corruption
in Nigeria or in Africa, what you do is make statements. How do you make
statements? It’s not difficult to fight corrupt government officials; it’s very
very easy because these guys are not that smart with the way they steal. By the
time he got in to office on May 29 2011, shortly by July of that year, he’d
have had like three or four corrupt cases and you know there’re transferred
corrupt cases from one regime to another. And he was an acting president before
he became president via what he called “the real mandate” and they would have
been seeing such practices. By the time they get the Economic and Financial
Crime Commission to arrest like five of them, within 10 days, charge serious
and tight allegations against them, prosecute them, then send five of them to
jail, shortly a lot of people will sit up. But if you allow corruption to just
run with no form of punishment, you’ll just have it grow. It’s a process. Start
the fight. It doesn’t mean you end it immediately, at least start the fight.
This president has been there for two years and he has essentially been breeding
corruption rather than fight it. So what would I have done? At least I would
have started the fight. I actually wouldn’t have won it in day one or even
after two or four years in office but I’d have at least started the fight
Lanre
Olagunju: talking about the EFCC, how independent are these agencies?
Omojuwa: they are not
independent and that’s the saddest part of it. The EFCC chairman is appointed
by the president then the senate have their own role to play but the bottom
line is that the EFCC chairman more or less answers to the president. If the
president says Mr Lanre Olagunju wants to contest in 2015 I need you guys to
build some corruption cases against him from now. And the EFCC has got to do
it. I mean we saw what Obasanjo did with the EFCC, these are things we need to
look at. …separate the office of the chairman of the Economic and Financial
Crimes Commission from the presidency, the office of the Inspector General of
police also should be separated from the presidency. The INEC chairman… how can
I appoint somebody who is going to be a referee in my own match? (Omojuwa screams and gets irritated)
those are obvious anomalies that we need to correct. These are some of the
things that we have to change if we are going to move forward or else we are
not going to have a society that runs on the bases of law and order.
Lanre
Olagunju: former minister for youth and development Mallam Bolaji Abdullahi
said a couple of months ago that over 67million young Nigerians are unemployed.
What do you think can be done to solve such problem and what is the impact of
such on the Nigerian economy?
Omojuwa: I’ve said that
already. What can be done to solve that is to put a system in place that allows
people to fulfill their dreams because when you say 67million Nigerians are
unemployed there are other unemployed people who are unemployed who don’t fall
into the category of young Nigerians so it’s about all Nigerians. We have about
112million poor people do you understand me? I mean you feel me? This is a
disaster anywhere in the world 112million poor people gathered in a place is a
social disaster so it’s not about 67 million unemployed young Nigerians alone,
it’s about the general society and it’s the same solution. You don’t gather a
few thousands of people out of that figure you mentioned and you say you are
giving them jobs or that you are giving them grants. You have to think
holistically and thinking holistically, you have to think of the masses .You do
not call 1000 people the masses when you have several millions of unemployed
people. It’s about allowing the economy to run by
providing the basic necessities. People spend eight hours in traffic that’s
more or less murder because by the time you calculate all the time spent
multiplied by all the different people and you put it together you realize that
that’s a lifetime. So these are things that we have to begin to check out.
Allow the economy to run. Create a free market economy and do away with cronyism
and monopolistic tendencies in terms of granting access to only political
jobbers and friends of those in politics.
Lanre
Olagunju: there seems to be a cozy relationship between you and Mallam Nasir
el-Rufai, do you talk highly about him because you know him personally or
because you belief in his achievements?
Omojuwa: I don’t talk
highly about him. I’ve met quite a number of people who were in government and
what I do is to ask them about their achievements while in office and also
request for documents that affirms that these were the things they did. Then on
eagle par, I’m not the one passing the judgment. An average person most
especially in Abuja agrees that he was an outstanding public officer. A member
of this government let me mention his name Reno Omokiri also told me … and Reno
is not in any way a friend to Mallam el-Rufai. He said and I have it in written
records that when it has to do with public service in Nigeria nobody has been
able to get to the bar of Nasir-el Rufai. That was what Reno said and I have
them on record in an email. He actually said that he has set a bar that has not
been reached. So if people like that and Kanu Agabi are able to say things like
that and majority of people I see in Abuja are saying since he left, things have
gone bad. And I as a person, I’m trying to encourage young people into
government, I see it as a responsibility to have young people relate with
people like that because obviously it was not every Nigerian that was in
government that failed. Aunty Oby Ezekwesili didn’t fail, so I don’t have a
problem with being close to people like that, learning and finding out how they
were able to go through a system that essentially looks like we have to be
corrupt to be there? So when you say cozy relationship, everyone defines cozy
in their own way but I have a very good relationship with him and with a whole
lot of people that were in public service. But he’s a kind of person that uses
social media a lot and social media is a place where whatever you say everybody
sees it. So it looks like his case is much more different. When you see former
public officers that I exchange DMs with every day you would think that…it’s
basically out of what he has done in the past. Let’s also know that as we speak
he’s being investigated and till date nothing has come out of it. And you know
how much it is to criticize the government. If there are things he doesn’t want
them to know he would have probably settled with them and he would have kept
quiet. For me that’s something that has to be recognized, otherwise we would
keep allowing the bad people in government to keep having their way without
giving the good ones the opportunity to speak out.
Lanre
Olagunju:What topic won’t you discuss on twitter?
Omojuwa: none…. Laughs
Lanre
Olagunju: from your brilliant analysis via your blogs, column, tweets and the
rest, many of your followers have expressed that you might just be another
Reuben Abati in the making considering that so far you haven’t done anything
differently from him before he became the presidential spoke person.
Omojuwa: (Japh becomes
infuriated) …I don’t know why people keep comparing me and Reuben Abati. I
haven’t even done anything close to what Reuben Abati has done. You feel me?! I
mean I just finished serving last year; last month (June) makes it a year after
my service year. I don’t understand why people keep bringing this Abati thing
into it…I don’t have any column on any major newspaper. I’m majorly focused on the internet and social
media and of course I get to do some other things offline but I don’t
like….because each time they bring the Abati thing up the next thing they say
is you too will be like Abati and those are all crap for me. Personally I’m not interested in such…are
they saying that because majority of Nigerian politicians have failed so if
they get into office they will fail. Let’s treat people and judge people based
on themselves and not based on what others have done with their own lives. I’m
who I am. I want to be judged based on who I am and not what I will do in the
future you can only judge me based on the facts of today; you can’t say because
some Abati has done something wrong then you use that to judge me. To do that
is to set yourself up to be a fool!
Lanre
Olagunju: what in your opinion do you think is responsible for the present
insecurity issue in Nigeria?
Omojuwa: The insecurity
issue is as a result of our failed system. Failed systems produce certain
things and one of them is insecurity. Go around the world, many countries that
has unemployment rate of 3 or less than 3percent don’t spend money on
insecurity. Countries that spend a huge chunk of their budget on insecurity are
countries that have huge unemployment issues. So unemployment is directly
proportional to insecurity. In a country where you don’t have employment,
there’s going to be insecurity because if people are not gainfully employed
then they will be un-gainfully employed. They have to do things to spend their
time. The human mind is dynamic. If it’s not producing something positively it
will produce negatively. When the system cannot channel the positive vibrant
energy of the young people into production then they are bound to have other
means of expressing their energy and that’s why we have terrorism, kidnapping
and then touting in places like Lagos. And that’s why you find Nigeria where
Nigeria is today.
Lanre
Olagunju: it’s quite unfortunate that things are the way they are today. But as
it is, what solution do your proffer to the insecurity issues in Nigeria today?
When it comes to solving the kind of insecurity
situation that we find ourselves at the moment, you don’t take anything away
from the table. People are dying every day and I’m shocked that people are
saying they shouldn’t do this or do that. You don’t take anything off the
table. You take it through an holistic approach. Only when some options have
failed is when you now take it off the table. As at today you don’t take
anything off the table. If dialogue will make them stop the killing, will you
rather not want them stop the killing?
Lanre
Olagunju: looking at your point of view, don’t you think it’s delicate to
dialogue with terrorist. What if after dialogue, tomorrow another group emerges
with crazy demands.
Omojuwa: There is no
perfect solution to a social problem. Every solution to a social problem has
its own disadvantages. If for instance, they are able to dialogue and are able
to get these people reformed. It’s not just about giving amnesty like what was
done to MEND. After giving amnesty what did you do to the general society?
There has to be a process in place so as to ensure that other young men who
were not militants are gainfully employed or else the amnesty idea becomes a
waste. It simply means that you reform the present militants and then you
abandon the unemployed ones to become future militants. So while reforming, the
unemployed ones must be provided employment. For instance, now you are focused
on amnesty then you abandon some other 69million people. You’re just wasting
your time because it’s just a matter of time the unemployed 69million will also
emerge as militants. So while dialoging
with Boko-Haram the government should squarely face unemployment as well. Unemployment
in Yobe is seven out of ten. Borno state is a disaster so you are not just
looking at Boko-Haram members directly but also the general members of the
society across Nigeria and making sure that people are gainfully employed,
making sure that opportunities for self-employment are there. When you do that
a lot of things will fall in place. Solutions are not a one off thing it has to
be holistic. You have to look into the big picture. If dialogue will make them
stop the killing today let’s stop the killing.
Lanre
Olagunju: What are your thoughts over the Lawan Farouk and Femi Otedola bribery
scandal?
Omojuwa: it’s sad that
you aren’t asking me about the fuel subsidy report but rather on the
consequences of the report, which is sad. My opinion essentially is that those
who don’t want this country to progress are again winning in their quest at
keeping Nigeria and Nigerians poor. Rather than focus on some N2 trillion or so
that has been stolen from our people, now we’ve been distracted by Farouk Lawan
and Otedola. So at the end, Nigeria and Nigerians will be the biggest losers if
we don’t begin to look at the bigger picture. I’m not saying Farouk Lawan and
Otedola’s case is not an important thing but let’s allow the law take its
course on both of them and let’s face the subsidy report. If people say the messenger has been
discredited therefore the message has been discredited so are they saying that
the 2 trillion Naira plus wasn’t stolen? Of course it was stolen. So let’s find a way to get the money back and
it’s not about setting up committees to review another committee and then
committee to aggregate the committees that were reviewed. That’s just
foolishness! (omojuwa frowns and screams). If we are going to solve this
problem let’s solve it and if we aren’t going to solve it let’s stop wasting
time and money pretending that we are solving it.
Lanre
Olagunju: the president said publicly that he has no hand in the whole drama.
How much can Nigerians belief that statement.
Omojuwa: you see trust is
born out of antecedents. If I use to tell you things in the past that turned
out to be lies will you trust me if I say a new thing? That’s it. I have
answered that question. Someone that has never kept his words before now, so how
can people begin to believe his words today?
Lanre
Olagunju: with this present administration, our debt accumulation is sky
rocketing what did he do wrong?
Omojuwa: As at the last count, one year N1.2trillion.
What did he do wrong? Everything! Some N44 billion just disappeared from our
account, no one has gone to jail and nothing has happened. Fuel subsidy scam is
just hovering around the news nothing has been done, SEC scam nothing has been
done, pension scam nothing has been done. Scam! Scam! Scam! What did he do
wrong? Look, there are two types of governance, there are things you do and the
things you don’t do. For the things he does, he does them wrongly and for the
things he doesn’t do, he doesn’t do at all. You talk about the fight against
corruption? Dead! He’s such a disaster. Everything is pretty clear, whatever
they tell people on NTA the results are there for everyone to see. And what we
have is a disaster.
Lanre
Olagunju: Are you married
Omojuwa: isn’t that
obvious. I’m not married……laughs
Post a Comment